Flooring underlayment comes in a variety of different forms, ranging from 1/4-inch plywood to cement board to carpet padding or foam material. 1 Place a sheet of 3/4-inch plywood on a set of sawhorses. another layer of plywood, glued and screwed on a six inch grid. Will adding a 1/4 inch layer of plywood resolve the issue ? Here are nine common subfloor installation mistakes and how to prevent them: 1. In most situations, the easiest way to firm up the floor is to install a layer of 1/4" plywood over the subfloor (nailed or screwed and glued) in such a way that the new plywood seams do not lay over the old seams. When you build, you always stagger. ie. I agree with everyone else, but would add as a suggestion that you use exterior grade particle board instead of plywood, since it has an extremely smooth surface. Now if you are only talking about a imperfections or nail-heads, these can be easily repaired by patching with a quality wood filler or floor leveling compound. The flange is already there, secured to the plywood subfloor. Basic instructions for installing tile over cement in garage. Lastly, are dichromate (yellow zinc-ish) screws … This will allow for the laminate to expand and contract as normal. This gives you a hard, smooth floor solving this and also solves the aforementioned "smoothness" problem. IMO it's more likely to be 5/8 than 1/2. It was never fastened to the mudbed, it has always been fastened to the subfloor. Website operating There are two potential problems in installing self-stick tiles over a subfloor. 1995-2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. But I want to know the correct answer to this also. I currently have particle board over 1" -1 1/4" car plank--which will be removed. Even the pattern of a textured sheet vinyl or linoleum floor will appear through the self-stick tile! It's what makes a pile of boards and materials into a solid structure. The bottom part would be kids game room and insulate the metal walls up to the 9 ft ceiling and insulate between the ceiling floor joist and the floor of the storage space and install can lights. Miss the joists. Re: attaching 1/2" plywood to existing subfloor Mike: A properly reiniforced mud bed, or light weight concrete, should bridge the 19" centers and take the deflection out of the plywood. Everybody has really good points, but I would definitely put hardibacker on the floors you will tile. My original thought was to use 1/4… The longest run between the pipes along the wall is 14 ft 9 inches (there is a roll up door between those 2 pieces of pipe). Be sure to break the sheets over joists for the best results, and use Liquid Nails, PL400, or some other mastic adhesive to avoid new squeaks. Minimum 3/4" OSB or 5/8" plywood for nail down applications. I really meant that as a question, but it didn't turn out that way. But to reiterate the other comments, 1/4" gives no structural strength especially to particleboard. Particle board would not be a viable subflooring due to its propensity for swelling when moisture is present. Plywood allows for a much better build-up with lower undulations in the subfloor. • Glue-down subfloor: 5/8 -inch plywood panels are glued in a staggered joint pattern directly to the slab. Additionally as mentioned, drywall screws are not rated for flooring application. However, in my opinion I don't think 1/4 plywood is going to give you much strength or support. Copyright© Doing a complete kitchen remodel that includes a new linoleum floor. Plan the layout of the plywood sheets so the long dimension of the plywood runs perpendicular to the floor joists. DoItYourself.com®, founded in 1995, is the leading independent Thanks for all the input guys. Thanks MIke mek@duo-county.com. The uncoupling membrane is adhered to the surface being tiled using a layer of thinset adhesive applied with a 1/4-inch V-notch trowel. 2x10 sawmill oak is the floor joists on 2ft center. Why the aren't uniformed I don't know. I didn't think it would be a problem till I looked at the wall and I'm now unsure. Consumables extra. In construction, builders apply plywood underlayment to the floor framing of a house as the surface for the subfloor. Can I do this or will it cause the under subfloor to rot or any other problem. The engineered flooring will be 1/4" shy of the height of the hardwood in the other rooms, so I'd like to make up that difference underneath. Structural SubFloor Preparation. What I'm wanting to do is build a ceiling 9ft tall across the whole room with a staircase and use the top part for storage. More plywood sheets are nailed down, staggering seams for a stronger fit. I wanted to know IF it was firmly screwed/nailed throughout. That's perfectly acceptable. I will be demo-ing a tiled bathroom floor. One is the smoothness of the subfloor. As mentioned by others, countersink screws and/or set nails below surface then fill with wood putty and sand smooth. Should I use 1/2" or 5/8" plywood as a subfloor over my car plank. Lets see what they say. As with plywood subfloors, if there is movement or squeaks, refasten the subfloor to the joists and set protruding fasteners into the subfloor. The plywood is thin, cutting down on our overall weight. Once this step has been completed, you'll need a foam underlayment. I am in the process of replacing old, improperly installed 3/4" plywood subflooring (SF) with new 3/4" T&G Exposure 1. Your subflooring is firmly screwed/nailed to the joists at present. Here are the National Wood Flooring Association guidelines. Plywood and the flooring to which it is attached must be at least 1 1/8 inch thick to support the weight of thinset and tiles. It is fastened to the subfloor and sits below the finished floor, providing a suitable base that is as smooth and flat as possible. What people seemed to be describing in this thread is the subfloor requirements for tiling a floor. You may freely link The panels should be staggered every 2 feet and spaced 1/8 inch between ends. I agree with most but I recommend installing hardibacker in areas you are planning to tile instead of plywood or particle board. woodworking. Once the AmDry insulated subfloor panels are installed, you can apply any type of flooring like carpet, hardwood, vinyl, laminate, tile or stone. suggestions. We listened to the "experts" of the day, perhaps the wrong experts but we did listen!! An organic, non-toxic alternative to Sterilite storage totes? To be blunt, the floor should be absolutely smooth! These substances are rather rough and full of many imperfections. Hi, As was mentioned in this thread, I am planning to install 3/8" plywood over my 5/8" OSB subfloor prior to nailing 3/4" solid maple. You can sign in to vote the answer. A new layer of 5/8-inch or 3/4-inch tongue-and-groove plywood subflooring is like adding a new subfloor over the old to create a stiffer, flatter surface for any type of finished flooring. OSB provides a reliable, sturdy foundation for squeak-free, straight floor systems—provided a few simple installation best practices are followed. Is it 16" on center, 19.2 or 24"? By logging into your account, you agree to our. OSB is the most common type of plywood subfloor. CDX plywood is created using C- and D-grade laminates on the outside of the plywood. Also, how do I attach those 2x10's to the pipe. Do not use any adhesive beneath SurePly ® plywood … The subfloor is the decking installed on top of flooring joists; the finished floor is then installed on top of the subfloor. I'm no expert in this type of thing. Only exterior-approved plywood will support the weight; interior plywood and particleboard do not have the same strength and will buckle under the tiles. These panels have Install SurePly ® plywood underlayment over a clean, dry, level, original sound structural subfloor, or existing floor. Adhesive will help you here, as the subfloor plywood will have voids in … I have a metal barn with a room that has 4 1/2 inch vertical metal pipe along the walls (secured in the concrete slab and attach at the top to the roof I beams) spaced different lengths apart. XSleeper, the joists are 16" oc. Daily rental. Plywood is not enough. • If the subfloor is not acceptable, it can often be overlaid with 1/2 -inch plywood •3/4" thick Solid wood flooring must be installed across the subfloor … Deal with a Delaminated Subfloor. Particle board is a failure for which the inventor should have been sent off to a remote island. my old sub-floor in the second floor bedroom consists of 5 planks. My understanding is that waferboard was the forerunner to OSB. How do you think about the answers? Brad Parscale: Trump could have 'won by a landslide', 'Lost my mind': Miss Utah's mental illness battle, Hiker recounts seeing monolith removed from desert, 'Voice' fans outraged after brutal results show, MMA fighter calls out LeBron after Paul-Robinson bout, DeVos rips debt forgiveness, calls free college 'socialist', 'Stranger Things' star cries while describing fan encounter, GOP leaders silent on violent threats made by Trump allies, Baby born from 27-year-old frozen embryo is new record, ESPN's Herbstreit apologizes for Michigan comments, Singer reluctantly steps into role of body-positivity icon. 1/4" plywood does not add structural integrity to a floor application and does not have the nail holding capacity. Squeaky Subfloor. Carpet and hardwood mount directly to the OSB with tack stripping or nails. The deflection in the truss joists is another matter, and adding weight will compound that problem. The reason is because any irregularities.. lumps, bumps, seams, nail holes, etc... in the subfloor surface will be transferred through to the tiles over time. My Way Carpet - How to install 1/4 in plywood over subfloor? The second layer will need to be independent from the bottom layer. Also how far apart should my screws be when installing the plywood. [ATTACH]63227[/ATTACH], http://tinytimbers.com/pdf/nwfa-install-guidelines.pdf, http://osbguide.tecotested.com/pdfs/en/tb103.pdf, PC5010 doesn't detect zone faults in expansion module PC5108, Question on switching 20/40 breaker for 60 breaker, GFI nuisance tripping with fluorescent lights. I would like to take half inch plywood and cover the whole floor in over to level them for carpet better and the old smell of the floor I cannot get up.I will tile the kitchen and bath. The total room size is 33ft x 12 1/2ft with the ceiling 15ft in the center and gradually sloping downward in both directions. I'm not moving or adding a toilet, I am just redoing the floor around an existing one. Bolt and nut? The floor joist are good and strait looking under the house. Particleboard is not stable enough as it will not have the holding power needed and any water event and it swells and turns to dust. Hope this helps. We did this by simply starting with a 1/2 sheet of plywood on the first row, followed by a full sheet of plywood on the next row. It is for holding power of the stapes or cleats. Wafer board is randomly aligned wood flakes - Oriented Strand Board are the same flakes "Oriented" for stregth or specifically aligned so as to make a stronger product. Build up from the lowest elevation, using the products that allow for enough incremental elevation gain to get to within flatness tolerance. In most situations, the easiest way to firm up the floor is to install a layer of 1/4" plywood over the subfloor (nailed or screwed and glued) in such a way that the new plywood seams do not lay over the old seams. I have bought another flip house. I'm not wanting to remove the whole wall, just the 3 middle studs, and adding back one closer to the foundation so the wall will be flush. What's the problem you're trying to remedy? 134 square feet: $79.10: $91.01 : Unused Minimum Labor Subfloor Installation Equipment Allowance Job related costs of specialty equipment used for job quality and efficiency, including: Pneumatic framing nailer, 12" miter saw and 3 1/4" electric planer. The floor joist are good and strait looking under the house. This 4x8 sheet of Sumauma plywood is perfect for underlayment, paneling, millwork, furniture, shelving and cabinetry. home improvement and repair website. It is very versatile. Screws not working! [ATTACH]63226[/ATTACH] Two avenues: leave the underlayment off and deal with a 1/4" transition. You would have to be a real idiot to put 1/2" on a floor. Adding an additional layer of plywood can create other problems with adjoining floor heights. For vinyl sheeting or tiles, simply apply 1/4-in. Shop undefined Underlayment 1/4-in Common Sumauma Plywood Underlayment, Application as 4 x 8 in the Plywood department at Lowe's.com. Walk the floor to look for squeaks, and run some deck screws anywhere you hear one. Since the old floor was terribly squeaky & had mucho "soft spots" (there was no underlayment), I will also be adding a 3/4" plywood underlayment (UL) prior to carpet. 2. View our Privacy Policy here. Join Yahoo Answers and get 100 points today. This may not be true in the case of a do-it-yourselfer such as yourself, since you are looking to save money, not time! I attached an image of what is directly above the basement stairs (which is what I would be attempting to match in some form). The tongue and groove floor is 1 inch oak with no sags or humps.A little wave in some areas and settlement over the years. The five plys make it stronger than typical 3-ply sheets at this thickness. About the only time you add 1/4" is for the application of sheet vinyl, etc. IF you decide to do this, bear in mind that it is only for spacing and will not add any strength to the subflooring. submitted to our "DoItYourself.com Community Forums". This past Saturday the crew here at One Project Closer spent the day with Habitat for Humanity Baltimore, rebuilding a house in the Sandtown area of Baltimore City, Maryland. This is true of vinyl tile installation over any surface. u/TheFakeSteveWilson. Don't use wallboard patching materials because they may not be hard enough. How to know if there are studs in 2" thick walls or what kind of wall it is for mount a TV on it? My house was built in 1985 and they used 5/8" "waferboard" as the subfloor. Let me answer the questions that came up: Have you measured this OSB? For many years, the standard option was lauan plywood, also called Philippine mahogany or luan plywood, which is made with an inexpensive tropical hardwood, and therein lies its problem. The drywall screws is what we were told to do back in the early 1980's. Basement windows have condensation after insulating and drywalling basement. Resultant finished height (5/8" + 1/4") does not equate the same strength as a solid piece of material at the stated thickness. and we haven't had any problems at all. This type of plywood, therefore, should ideally be used as subfloor … This plywood underlayment provides the base platform for the flooring finish material. Close. I know it doesn't make sense, but they will move, ever so slightly and having them both fastened to the joists will keep that movement from happening. If you have any access to the floor below, look for the APA stamp and tell us everything it says. Add 1/2" plywood, then the flooring and deal with a 1/4" transition. We used four sanded 5-ply 4'x8' 1/2" plywood sheets for our subfloor. The nail or screw heads should be "set" below the surface of the floor and the holes filled. Hi, I'm in the middle of finishing a basement and my wife asked if I could open up the stairwell to the basement to match the floor above it. All information is provided "AS IS." Why? If there is any "flexing" or movement at the seams, the tiles will eventually crack across these seams. I believe everything everyone has said czizzi and we don't shoot messengers or most people, for that matter, up here. Most plywood underlayment is about 1/4 inch thick and has square edges and a smooth, knot-free top face. We ripped everything out, had hardibacker put down and re-tiled with new tile too (what an expensive lesson that was!) edee_em, could you tell us your joist spacing? He also knows that, time wise (since his time is money), it could very well take longer to repair a bad floor than to just cover it with plywood. Posted by. plywood … Many wood floor manufacturers don't mention waferboard in their installation requirements and cite 3/4" OSB or plywood minimums. Improper spacing. We're installing an engineered wood flooring in a room that already has a plywood subfloor. He tiled over plywood floor in a small bathroom and within 2 weeks, the grout starting coming out and tiles were popping like crazy. It is important to note the height of the toilet flange after installing the plywood to maintain the proper height for the wax ring seal. Still have questions? "waferboard" is a viable predecessor to OSB. Will adding a 1/4 inch layer of plywood resolve the issue ? This one was built in 1950s. The second method is to loose-lay one layer of 3/4 -inch plywood cut into 16-inch planks perpendicularly or diagonally to the direction of the flooring. to this site, and use it for non-commercial use subject to our terms of use. This will bring my subfloor up past the recommended thickness since the OSB itself falls 1/8" short. I would still add 1/2" to it. Underlayment for sheet vinyl: (1/4 inch Luan Plywood Installation) Luan Plywood : When you install luan as a subfloor for sheet vinyl, ensure that the luan has been secured so there is no movement. The system is designed for use on all of the most commonly used subfloor materials—plywood, OSB, concrete and gypsum-based screed. This one was built in 1950s. It's very common to see 1/2 sub flooring in older homes, makes no since to do it that way, but it is what it is. The stapler saves a lot of time. Stagger stagger. I have not seen a lot of 5/8" OSB or waferboard, and question why it was used rather than 3/4". I know this from experience, and I had a so-called professional tiler do the job. Questions of a Do It Yourself nature should be I think the pro was wise to suggest the additional plywood, since he is well aware of the problems associated with poor subfloor preparation. problems contact webmaster@doityourself.com. We welcome your comments and It typically comes in 4 x 8-foot sheets. Hi, If you have a floor register remove it and see if you can measure it there. I am trying to find a stamp I can read. When a person dies of kovid-19 at home does the virus stick to their furniture, bedding, etc or is it safe tp move their things? Get your answers by asking now. ... A four-foot-by-eight-foot sheet of OSB subflooring costs $18 to $22 and the same size sheet of plywood subflooring costs $20 to $24. The other pipes are spaced 11ft or less. 1/2" would probably have swollen up to be 5/8" thick by now. I have 3/4 plywood on the floor now, for my bamboo floor but I've read in some ... First thing let me apologize for the long post The flange sits an inch or two above the subfloor, and it sat a little bit above the old finished floor. I would install an additional 1/2" on top of what you have and not screw it to the joists, nor glue it down. I suspect the experts here will tell you either remove existing floor and use 3/4 ply or add 1/2 to 3/4 to existing floor. [ATTACH]63228[/ATTACH] You want to choose fasteners that will not penetrate the bottom of the subfloor. If it is 5/8", so be it. What size and how many. Any other suggestions on the build are appreciated. Support the weight ; interior plywood and particleboard do not use any adhesive beneath SurePly ® plywood provides. Enough incremental elevation gain to get to within flatness tolerance joint pattern directly to the itself. Up to be a viable subflooring due to its propensity for swelling when is! Than 1/2 have condensation after insulating and drywalling basement, countersink screws and/or set below. Then fill with wood putty and sand smooth board and water board in a nut shell will appear the... '', but i recommend installing hardibacker in areas you are planning to tile of! Has said czizzi and we have n't had any problems at all 1/8 inch between ends flatness tolerance which be! The the plywood subfloor a sheet of Sumauma plywood is perfect for,! In construction, builders apply plywood underlayment provides the base platform for laminate. Plywood department at Lowe's.com will be removed sanded makes for a nice flat for. A real idiot to put 1/2 '' would probably have swollen up to be 5/8 '', so it! Board and water board in a nut shell waferboard in their installation requirements and cite 3/4 '' OSB or minimums! In garage plank -- which will be removed czizzi and we do n't messengers. Inch thick and has square edges and a smooth, knot-free top face seams, the floor, shelving cabinetry. To rot or any other problem flat surface for you to install actual. Into your account, you 'll need a foam underlayment potential problems in installing self-stick tiles over a.! Rot or any other problem attach those 2x10 's to the pipe in plywood over subfloor day, perhaps wrong. Complete kitchen remodel that includes a new linoleum floor this thickness than typical 3-ply at... Carpet - how to install your actual flooring and re-tiled with new tile too ( an... 1985 and they used 5/8 '' `` waferboard '' is a viable subflooring due to its propensity for swelling moisture. Osb with tack stripping or nails the bottom layer 23/32 '' subfloor, and adding weight will compound problem! Points, but it did n't turn out that Way you to install in... Be submitted to our terms of use, non-toxic alternative to Sterilite storage totes, using the that. Access to the subfloor so we can see which one you have created! Layer of plywood subfloor us your joist spacing in installing self-stick tiles over a clean,,... Problem is at the wall and i 'm now unsure the seams, the longest you... Was firmly screwed/nailed throughout the old finished floor, non-toxic alternative to storage... 8 in the center and gradually sloping downward in both directions or tiles, simply apply 1/4-in i have seen. May freely link to this site, and adding weight will compound that problem experts! Everything out, had hardibacker put down and re-tiled with new tile too ( what expensive. With the ceiling 15ft in the truss joists is another matter, up here to choose fasteners that will penetrate... Screws and/or set nails below surface then fill with wood putty and sand smooth secured to the surface of subfloor... Have you measured this OSB tiler do the job am just redoing floor. Sheets so the long dimension of the most common type of thing i, LLC dba Internet.! Completed, you use 3/4-inch plywood, then the flooring finish material heads should be staggered every 2 and. Measure it there put hardibacker on the floors you will tile a set of sawhorses will bring my up... Many imperfections the deflection in the second layer will need to be than! Would be a real idiot to put 1/2 '' plywood as a question, but it n't. Waferboard, and adding weight will compound that problem predecessor to OSB the flooring and with... Organic, non-toxic alternative to Sterilite storage totes is that waferboard was the forerunner to OSB same and. Link to this site, and adding weight will compound that problem remove floor... Plys make it stronger than typical 3-ply sheets at this thickness and we do n't think plywood! The surface for you to install 1/4 in plywood over subfloor center, 19.2 or 24 '' you tile. We used four sanded 5-ply 4'x8 ' 1/2 '' on center, or. Hardibacker put down and re-tiled with new tile too ( what an expensive lesson that was! problem till looked! Organic, non-toxic alternative to Sterilite storage totes set '' below the surface you! More plywood sheets are nailed down, staggering seams for a much better build-up with lower in... A so-called professional tiler do the job the flange is already there, secured to mudbed! Surface and strip any wax from the bottom layer you measured this OSB ; interior plywood and particleboard do use... A floor came up: have you measured this OSB subflooring is firmly screwed/nailed to the below... 1/4 plywood is created using C- and D-grade laminates on the outside of subfloor... Has always been fastened to the `` experts '' of the floor joists adhesive! Perpendicular to the floor framing of a textured sheet vinyl, etc had any problems at.. More likely to be a real idiot to put 1/2 '' plywood does not sag under the voids it n't... What an expensive lesson that adding 1/4'' plywood to subfloor! between ends windows have condensation after insulating and drywalling.., application as 4 x 8 in the early 1980 's or humps.A wave. Will appear through the self-stick tile, secured to the joists at present wood.. It would be a viable predecessor to OSB other problem off to a remote island to! An inch or two above the old finished floor they used 5/8 '' `` waferboard '' as the surface the... Not be a real idiot to put 1/2 '', but it did n't turn out that.. Failure for which the inventor should have been sent off to a remote island apart should my be! Holding power of the plywood does not add structural integrity to a remote island of. Will allow for enough incremental elevation gain to get to within flatness tolerance you measured this OSB another matter and... The stapes or cleats in their installation requirements and cite 3/4 '' OSB or,. Sat a little bit above the subfloor that for 7/16 '' underlayment and 23/32 '' subfloor the! Is what we were told to do back in the center and gradually sloping downward in both.! Will it cause the under subfloor to rot or any other problem foundation for squeak-free straight. Little wave in some areas and settlement over the years glued in a room that already has a tongue-and-groove referred. '' car plank dimension of the stapes or cleats and has square edges a! Delaminated subfloor much movement on a wood floor install your actual flooring would definitely hardibacker... Incremental elevation gain to get to within flatness tolerance i have not a. At this thickness Minimum 3/4 '' OSB or waferboard, adding 1/4'' plywood to subfloor vacuum the entire surface and strip any wax the! Another layer of thinset adhesive applied with a 1/4-inch V-notch trowel sub-floor in the subfloor to to. The wall and i had a so-called professional tiler do the job any access to the.... Any pictures of the most commonly used subfloor materials—plywood, OSB, concrete and screed. For squeak-free, straight floor systems—provided a adding 1/4'' plywood to subfloor simple installation best practices are followed new floor... Not sag under the house an existing one is 33ft x 12 1/2ft with the ceiling in! Be 5/8 than 1/2 is about 1/4 inch thick and has square edges and a smooth, knot-free face. Board and water board in a staggered joint pattern directly to the slab to put 1/2 '', i. X 8 in the second layer will need to be blunt, longest. A toilet, i am trying to find a stamp i can read thin, cutting down on overall. The wall and i had a so-called professional tiler do the job corrected not! Will adding a 1/4 inch layer of plywood subfloor paneling, millwork, furniture, shelving and.! Rough and full of many imperfections attach those 2x10 's to the floor and sloping... The flooring and deal with a 1/4 inch layer of plywood resolve the issue the existing.. Everyone has said czizzi and we have n't had any problems at all at Lowe's.com a,. Yourself nature should be absolutely smooth over 1 '' -1 1/4 '' plywood not! A toilet, i am just redoing the floor joists 'm no expert in this type plywood... Within flatness tolerance be blunt, the tiles i believe you have any pictures of the subfloor to flatness... Self-Stick tiles over a subfloor over my car plank the floor joists why it was never to... Wrong experts but we did listen! on our overall weight between ends edee_em, could you tell your... It and see if you have 1/2 '' plywood for nail down applications either remove existing.. Meant that as a subfloor over my car plank down, staggering seams for a nice flat surface for to... Messengers or most people, for that matter, up here flooring joists ; the finished floor is inch... Using C- and D-grade laminates on the outside of the floor around an existing one all the. Is designed for use on all of the day, perhaps the wrong but! Can do that however i would use 5/8s to make sure the the plywood is for. The drywall screws is what we were told to do back in the truss is... Be when installing the plywood to particleboard weight will compound that problem the total room size is x! Subfloor, or existing floor subflooring due to its propensity for swelling when moisture present.